[Foundation-l] Fwd: [Wikipedia-l] Dutch chapter

Tue Apr 18 21:45:05 UTC 2006

Hoi,
With some suprise I have seen from a distance a situation arise by
people who did not involve themselves during the setup of the Dutch
chapter. If anything I can vouch for the fact that one of the guiding
principles during the setup of the chapter was to maximise the
community aspect.

This idea of there being a group that secretly decide on "everyting
and the kitchen sink" is odd. The meetings have all been public. They
were all announced in advance and this suggestion is without a basis.
I am in an excellent position to vouch for this. I have been at
several of these meetings.

The cool thing is, a "vereniging" and even a "stichting" have been set
up. The preparations are being done so that there will be a
bank-account and that there can be members of the "vereniging". There
will be a meeting where members can do the member thing. I sincerely
hope that this will be an opportunity for people to meet in a
reasonable way and most definetly to start doing what a chapter is
ment for. Have an organisational background for the activities that we
want to do.

Thanks,
    GerardM

On 4/18/06, Johan Bos <skatinghacker at hotmail.com> wrote:
> I think the biggest problem is that a certain group of Dutch moderators take
> decisions for example to block someone for a long time, without being
> interested in the opinion of the community. Something there is some admin
> power abuse done by that specific group of moderators. Now the case is that
> most members of that specific group of moderators are active in the
> foundation. The processes to form the foundation are very unclear and most
> of the important decisions have been taken during IRL meetings. Only people
> who visited those meetings had any influence at the forming of the
> foundation and the association.
>
> Now the danger is that members of the Dutch foundation take certain
> decisions, maybe under pressure of a Dutch judge or organisation or maybe
> just there own POV. And then they use there power to force their decision.
> Abuse like that will be a serious risk when de foundation would get any
> power.
>
> A lot of Dutch Wikipedians feel that de Dutch foundation is trying to take
> over the power at our Wikipedia and they are grumbling about it.
>
> Greetings,
>
> Johan Bos
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Anthere" <Anthere9 at yahoo.com>
> To: <foundation-l at wikimedia.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2006 10:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] Fwd: [Wikipedia-l] Dutch chapter
>
>
> > Hi
> >
> > Which are the reasons why the Foundation and the association have little
> > support ? People ? Bylaws ? Goals ?
> >
> > Ant
> >
> > Johan Bos wrote:
> >> I agree with Andre. Nor the Dutch foundation, nor the Dutch association
> >> has
> >> a broad support in Dutch community. The community has hardly any
> >> influence
> >> to the foundation and the association. A lot of users are complaining.
> >>
> >> The foundation and the association could do a great job for our project,
> >> but
> >> as soon as they get any special power to the encyclopedia, there will
> >> come
> >> troubles.
> >>
> >> So, I have no problem with the foundation and the association, but they
> >> shouldn't have any power to the Wikimedia Projects and they shouldn't
> >> have
> >> any official position within WMF.
> >>
> >> Johan Bos (nl:Jcb)
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Erik Moeller" <eloquence at gmail.com>
> >> To: "Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List" <foundation-l at wikimedia.org>
> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 18, 2006 8:29 PM
> >> Subject: [Foundation-l] Fwd: [Wikipedia-l] Dutch chapter
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>I'm forwarding this to foundation-l as it seems to be the more
> >>>relevant list. Thread so far at:
> >>>http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/wikipedia-l/2006-April/thread.html#44205
> >>>
> >>>Erik
> >>>
> >>>---------- Forwarded message ----------
> >>>From: Andre Engels <andreengels at gmail.com>
> >>>Date: Apr 18, 2006 4:52 PM
> >>>Subject: [Wikipedia-l] Dutch chapter
> >>>To: wikipedia-l at wikimedia.org
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>I think I speak for most of the Dutch Wikipedians if I say:
> >>>* Neither the Dutch Wikimedia Foundation (Stichting Wikimedia
> >>>Nederland) nor the Dutch Wikimedia Association (Vereniging Wikimedia
> >>>Nederland) has the right to influence the content and procedures of
> >>>the Dutch Wikipedia
> >>>* The board of neither has any formal special position on the Dutch
> >>>Wikipedia
> >>>* At least the Dutch Wikimedia Foundation should not be allowed to
> >>>speak in name of the Dutch Wikipedia
> >>>* The Wikimedia Foundation is hereby requested not to give the Dutch
> >>>Wikimedia Foundation the status of chapter or any similar status
> >>>
> >>>Thank you.
> >>>
> >>>--
> >>>Andre Engels, andreengels at gmail.com
> >>>ICQ: 6260644  --  Skype: a_engels
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Wikipedia-l mailing list
> >>>Wikipedia-l at Wikimedia.org
> >>>http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>foundation-l mailing list
> >>>foundation-l at wikimedia.org
> >>>http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >>>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > foundation-l at wikimedia.org
> > http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l at wikimedia.org
> http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>