Hi, Le Sunday 19 September 2004 08:54, Mark Williamson a écrit : Not at all. I find it very reasonable that any project show at least some support from a minimum of contributors. As an example, Wikitravel has a rule to get 5 contributors before staring a new language project. I think a rule like this should be necessary to start any project within the WMF. Best wishes, Yann -- http://www.non-violence.org/ | Site collaboratif sur la non-violence http://www.forget-me.net/ | Alternatives sur le Net http://fr.wikipedia.org/ | Encyclopédie libre http://www.forget-me.net/pro/ | Formations et services Linux

I'm not referring to conlangs as they are more controversial and should be dealt with separately. However I would ask you the following questions: 1. does anybody speak your conlang as their native language? 2. if not, does anybody use it in their daily life significantly more than any other language? 3. How many speakers does it have overall? If your answer to 1 was "yes", I would definitely consider supporting it. If your answer to 2 was yes and your answer to 3 was over 1000 or so, I would consider supporting it. However, the majority of conlangs (especially newly-created ones) do not have very many speakers, and even those that do oftentimes have no native speakers or nobody who uses them more than any other language in their day-to-day life. --node On Sun, 19 Sep 2004 17:21:50 +0200, Andre Engels <andrewiki(a)freemail.nl> wrote:

On Sep 20, 2004, at 11:31 PM, Brion Vibber wrote: http://mail.wikipedia.org/pipermail/wikitech-l/2004-May/010194.html I have *asked* if anybody can help to transfer the articles from old holopedia to the newly created min-nan wikipedia but it seems that developers are too busy. The dump is still out there http://tmjiang.dyndns.org/wikipedia/wikipedia-backup.sql Can we copy the old articles with history to the new min-nan wikipedia, to avoid conflict, we can try to add a tag to old article name to be xxxx_old or something like that. Once the xxxx_old articles are moved to the new min-nan wikipedia, we can do the merge or rename of the articles. best pektiong

Brion Vibber wrote: <snip> I wgeted dump in /home/wikipedia/ in case the dyndns site come down :o) -- Ashar Voultoiz

Well, you have a number of different options. The first and probably best would be to go to Wikipedia forks such as Wikinfo and mcfly (ok, maybe not mcfly) and tell them how the folks at the Wikimedia organisation are... well, describe your plight. Some forks really hate the Wikimedia foundation and will feel very sorry for you and assist you with such a project, whereas others seem to be meant more to augment Wikipedia and their users still contribute to Wikipedia on a regular basis. Another option would be to pay for private hosting and set up the MediaWiki software yourself, which I can tell you is not going to be very pleasant if you're not experienced in setting up server-side apps. You could probably also hire somebody to maintain the software for you (often hosting companies will offer such services), but that's just another additional cost. The only other option I can think of at the moment is to use one of the free wiki hosts available on the internet. Let me tell you in advance, they all suck. Really, really suck. But obviously, they are free so you don't have to pay anybody as you would in the second scenario. best, node ps I thought the final decision was to go ahead and create ang:? On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 16:36:25 -0400, James R. Johnson &lt;modean52(a)comcast.net&gt; wrote:

Mark Williamson wrote: I don't mind if people squat on empty wikis, since their secrecy means that they won't be able to request help writing language files, or to ask for help in making interlanguage links. In fact, I'll happily create any wiki if the potential contributors agree in advance to use a language file which is already mature, and that you refrain from requesting interface customisations which require developer attention. If that seems like a bizarre rule, then maybe you should re-read my posts, where I have repeatedly attempted to explain my objection. James R. Johnson wrote: Same goes for you, unless you can convince one of the other developers to set this up. I find it hard to believe that I'm in this situation, that I'm the only one willing to even talk about setting up these wikis. It puts me in a situation of power that I'm not asking for. But if that's how it has to be, then I guess we have to talk about a compromise. -- Tim Starling

On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 15:44:39 +1000, Tim Starling &lt;ts4294967296(a)hotmail.com&gt; wrote: This seems like a reasonable suggestion for most of the languages under debate. The tiny langs with no articles in them often have the default english interface and logo, which doesn't keep people from starting to develop content... -- +sj+

On Mon, 27 Sep 2004 18:20:42 -0700 Mark Williamson &lt;node.ue(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote: na.wiktionary does not really exist, so how can it be fraudulent? I have done a look, and haven't been able to recognize the language. [[Nauru Bwiema]] seems to be real Nauruan, but other parts have indeed another feel, more like a Romanic language; Spanish seems to be closest, but I know too little to say that with any certainty. But then "Liao gu Xiao" sounds more like Chinese (although going from Spanish we could perhaps etymologize Xiao=Ciudad). Andre Engels

I thought it would be created also...there was quite a bit of support when I originally proposed the idea, and then everyone started talking about Chinese and Gothic. The only reason I heard against it is that someone didn't feel like it. But, what about all the wikis with less than 10 articles? Looks like they don't feel like it either. I looked, and the Afar, Armenian, Assamese, Aymara, Bashkir, Bengali, Bhojpuri, Bislama, Burmese, Dzongkha, Fijian, Georgian, Greenlandic, Gujarati, Kannada, Kashmiri, Kazakh, Khmer, Kyrgiz, Lao, Lojban, Quechua, Manx, Nepali, Oriya, Oromo, Panjabi, Pashtu, Rumansh, Sardinian, Setswana, Somali, Sindhi, Sotho, Tajik, Telugu, Tibetan, Tongan, Tsonga, Turkmen, Twi, Uighur, and Xhosa have 10 or fewer articles. Are those who thought little of Gothic or Anglo-Saxon going to look again at those wikis? Just a thought. James -----Original Message----- From: wikipedia-l-bounces(a)Wikimedia.org [mailto:wikipedia-l-bounces@Wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of Mark Williamson Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 5:50 PM To: wikipedia-l(a)wikimedia.org Subject: Re: [Wikipedia-l] Starting a new wiki Well, you have a number of different options. The first and probably best would be to go to Wikipedia forks such as Wikinfo and mcfly (ok, maybe not mcfly) and tell them how the folks at the Wikimedia organisation are... well, describe your plight. Some forks really hate the Wikimedia foundation and will feel very sorry for you and assist you with such a project, whereas others seem to be meant more to augment Wikipedia and their users still contribute to Wikipedia on a regular basis. Another option would be to pay for private hosting and set up the MediaWiki software yourself, which I can tell you is not going to be very pleasant if you're not experienced in setting up server-side apps. You could probably also hire somebody to maintain the software for you (often hosting companies will offer such services), but that's just another additional cost. The only other option I can think of at the moment is to use one of the free wiki hosts available on the internet. Let me tell you in advance, they all suck. Really, really suck. But obviously, they are free so you don't have to pay anybody as you would in the second scenario. best, node ps I thought the final decision was to go ahead and create ang:? On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 16:36:25 -0400, James R. Johnson &lt;modean52(a)comcast.net&gt; wrote: set costs work _______________________________________________ Wikipedia-l mailing list Wikipedia-l(a)Wikimedia.org http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikipedia-l

Yann Forget wrote: The Nobel Prize (1913) winner Tagore wrote in Bengali, though probably mostly for those works that were available in English at the time. I understand that there far more of his works that have never been translated. Tagore died in 1941, so his works are essentially all in the public domain based on the life plus 60 law that prevails for India. These are probably langiages that we would really like to serve. Gujarati, Punjabi and Pashtu all have significant diasporas where there are people that are in a better position to take the initiative. Here in the Vancouver area the Punjabi Sikhs are one of the largest immigrant communities. Maybe I should enter into promotional discussions with some of them.. Another advantage that is available for the Asian languages is an established written language. This is not the case for most African or native American languages. It's just a matter of time before the Asians get it together. Ec

Hmm... If it does, I can help with typing them in (if they're not already typed). --node On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 19:25:23 +0200, Yann Forget &lt;yann(a)forget-me.net&gt; wrote:

Hi, Le Tuesday 21 September 2004 22:25, Ray Saintonge a écrit : For me, this looks like a dead old language. Doesn't even deserve a wiki. ;o) Le Tuesday 21 September 2004 19:46, Mark Williamson a écrit : For a start, I have already 8 volumes from Mahadev Desai who was the personal secretary of M. K. Gandhi and died in 1942. These are his dairy during the 25 years he worked with Gandhi. See http://r2d2.homeunix.org/mahadev_desai/day-to-day/ (600 to 850 KB of plain English text each) cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahadev_Desai I created the base but there is a lot of work, especially because each volume has an index, which would be nice to have it working. cf. http://wikisource.org/wiki/Day_to_Day_with_Gandhi Regards, Yann -- http://www.non-violence.org/ | Site collaboratif sur la non-violence http://www.forget-me.net/ | Alternatives sur le Net http://fr.wikipedia.org/ | Encyclopédie libre http://www.forget-me.net/pro/ | Formations et services Linux

On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 16:38:30 -0700, Ray Saintonge &lt;saintonge(a)telus.net&gt; wrote: You could add an anchor tag at each original page-break, and leave the original index with its page numbers. +sj+

YF> There are other features which are much needed for Wikisource. YF> One is footnote. There are also plenty of foonotes in this book, and I don't YF> know what to do with them. YF> Yann [[#something]] wikilinks? -- Ausir mailto:fallout@lexx.eu.org http://fallout.scifi.pl ICQ 41090834 GG 2730728

Hi, Le Wednesday 22 September 2004 11:28, Henry H. Tan-Tenn a écrit : Yes, localization of computers is one of the necessary steps before people could contribute. Literacy is another one. As an example, in Gujarat, about 30 % of the population is illetrate, but that figure is a poor indication of the capacity to contribute to an encyclopedia. I have a friend who is graduated from the Indian Institute of Management, a school with a worldwide reputation (teachers come from Havard, etc.), but can't read or write Gujarati, her mother tongue. Today in India, it is fashionable to send children to English medium schools, which are usually more expensive and of higher quality than local languages schools. So educated people are perfectly fluent in English, but illetrate in their mother tongue. Regards, Yann -- http://www.non-violence.org/ | Site collaboratif sur la non-violence http://www.forget-me.net/ | Alternatives sur le Net http://fr.wikipedia.org/ | Encyclopédie libre http://www.forget-me.net/pro/ | Formations et services Linux

On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 23:38:56 -0400 "James R. Johnson" &lt;modean52(a)comcast.net&gt; wrote: No, I don't see these cases as similar at all. All these languages, perhaps with a few exceptions, are for some people their preferred language of communication. Thus, there is a *potential* for a blooming Wikipedia in those; it happens to be the case that we haven't attracted any Wikipedians working on them yet, but chances are high that at some point there will be people interested in reading and writing them. On the other hand, for Anglo-Saxon or Gothic, there are people who are able to read and write it, but I have not been convinced yet that there are people who prefer to read their encyclopedia in those languages, nor that people would write them in an attempt to spread information rather than for novelty value. Andre Engels