[Wikipedia-l] Use of images (again)

Wed Jun 28 16:01:02 UTC 2006

After this I will contact you directly since it's less relevant to
this mailing list. But I will make a couple of points that might be
relevant:

On 29/06/06, Berto <albertoserra at ukr.net> wrote:
> Hi again!
>
> > (Universal login: we at Commons await it more than anyone else,
> > possibly. ;)) As for English login, not quite. We have managed to
> > internationalise the login as much as possible: see
> > http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:Userlogin .
>
> Yes, I've used it myself. The main problem is that most users who are afraid
> of english will never get to see, because they will simply not click on the
> *login* link. Anyway, if we can setup a proper instruction page on local
> bases (that is, on pms) we can bridge this. The same would apply to
> interliki links. If one can mantain a usable UI on *any* edition he will not
> fear trying even the most exotic language... and this really is a quick way
> to locate additional pics to use in a given context.

There is a very useful possibility you might not be aware of... try this:

http://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Main_Page&uselang=pms

If you can give this link to your users (probably won't be able to
through a menu, but on an article/page, yes), it might be easier. Of
course as soon as they click on any link, the "&uselang=pms" will
disappear and the menus will go back to English. So better make sure
Special:Userlogin is the 2nd thing they click on. :P

BTW I think this trick should also work perfectly on wikipedias. And
it should work even better since the menus won't be different.

> > ) that it is now possible to have "Optional language selector for user
> > login/registration forms". So I certainly hope Commons will be the
> > first place to implement that.
> I see it on all editions (more precisely: IT, EN, META, COMMONS) even now...
> so probably we talk about different selectors. My common:user works in pms
> lang, so do my it:user, en:user, meta:user, etc.

You are talking about the language selector at
[[Special:Preferences]], right? Yes, that works everywhere. I am
talking about a drop-down box for anonymous users to go through the
signup process. At the moment no one has this, it is a new feature.

 What worries me is that a
> user needs to undergo a first page in a foreign language, in order to do
> this. If we could just send the user language as a link parameter we could
> probably solve the problem...

See above :P

> > > 2) there is no way for a local edition to use commons as an "included"
> > > service (that is, one page as another, inside the edition).
> I mean having your upload page instead of mine. Which means all the links in
> the page drive the user back into pms, while only upload functions and image
> galleries relate to your server from everywhere in pms. Having exported fake
> pages is okay, too. The thing I do not wnat to happen is an unexperienced
> user to get lost somewhere beween two servers. What I want is having commons
> "seamiglessly" integrated in local editions. People should not even know
> that they are changing servers, unles they are interested in the tech
> details and go reading the docs. Most users do not give a damn about it, all
> they want is their pic to be uploaded for them to use it in an article, not
> a conference on distributed systems management.

Yes, indeed... it is possible to make the upload page link to Commons,
but they will of course be taken to Commons. And until we have
universal login, they will have to sign up again. And they will have
to meet Commons requirements of image source, necessary license
information and (very strongly encouraged) category or gallery link.
But I check newbie users at the moment and 19/20 do not use
categories, so I don't expect pms-users to be any different. :)

> > File descriptions are NOT required to be in
> > English at all.
> Yes, but I really wonder what can a japanese user get from a pms file
> description.

Well I really doubt anyone will use an image if it has a caption they
can't understand at all. They will simply not use the file. OK that is
a loss but until we require that everyone knows 20 languages :) not
much we can do.

> >ie....are Italian help files and messages sufficient for Piedmontese
> speakers?
> No. In every day life it almost always gets substituted by ITA in Piedmont,
> and if we cannot keep an homogenous linguistic environment for our users we
> really risk turning all our efforts to failure. We need people to have a
> place for them to use the language for all kind of needs, if we want them to
> develop that proficiency that is necessary to write a good pms wiki. It's a
> pity, because it actually means that I get an additional load of
> translations work on my "to-do" list, but unfortunately that's the way it
> is...

OK, I understand that.

When it comes to interacting with other users, unless a PMS admin
takes on a lot of translation, they will probably have to use some
English or something else. I encourage all Commons users to use Babel
boxes.

> Mmmm... I can't seem to guess your nick on common... you can leave me mail
> on http://pms.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discussioni_utente:Bèrto_'d_Sèra so we can
> define a practical action plan for the merger... :) We got some 80 pics so
> far, If we manage to transfer them now it will be easier than making it once
> they already grew up to 800.

OK, great. Oops, sorry I didn't write my username. it's user:pfctdayelise .

cheers,
Brianna