[Foundation-l] FW: [Wikinews-l] Increased incivility at wikinews [en] <warning: contains rant>

Thu Feb 5 16:57:57 UTC 2009

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 8:32 AM, Marc Riddell <michaeldavid86 at comcast.net> wrote:
> When will you people finally acknowledge that there is something terribly
> wrong with the deteriorating level of discourse occurring in the Projects?

One does not know deteriorated discourse unless they've, you know,
lived in the projects.[1]

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 9:45 AM, Andrew Whitworth <wknight8111 at gmail.com> wrote:
> If a project so large in size and scope as English Wikipedia is having
> these problems with hostility and incivility, you're maybe seeing a
> manifestation of problems in human nature itself. See [[w:Dubar's
> Number]] for more information about large groups like this. If you
> can't fix the problem from within English Wikipedia, then the problems
> are likely to be unfixable.

Interesting article. I just realized my Bacon number is higher than my
Dunbar number, thanks Andrew.

On Thu, Feb 5, 2009 at 10:08 AM, Marc Riddell
<michaeldavid86 at comcast.net> wrote:
> Andrew, it is not the size of the group that is the issue, but how that
> group is managed. And there is a huge cultural difference between "control"
> and "management". It all rests with the skillful leadership of that group.
> It is my professional business to know such things.

Yes, "management" implies that those subjected to it enjoy some degree
of freedom, so that it still seems fun for them. Treading lightly in
this regard is crucial.

Or in the business world, assuming a supervisory position most often
imply a departure from actual work. Even one's de jure duty of
"supervising" can easily be delegated to a lower person: "Go supervise
these people." ... "B-but you're the boss here, not me." ... "Yes, I
am your boss. Now: go supervise these people." ... "So I'm their boss
now?" ... "Yup."

Conversations like this usually mark the birth of a workplace Ponzi
scheme. I've been in scenarios like this much of my adult life.

—C.W.

[1] the "t" is silent.