[Foundation-l] Incubator Wiki for New Wikimedia Projects (was Vote to create Wikiversity Vote)

Tue Nov 15 11:42:04 UTC 2005

On 11/14/05, Angela <beesley at gmail.com> wrote:
> On 11/14/05, Anthony DiPierro <wikilegal at inbox.org> wrote:
> > Wikimedia should stick to creating and
> > distributing informational materials.  There are wikis on Wikicities
> > which qualify, though.  The poker one comes to mind (because that's
> > one of the few I've actually participated in).
>
> The original poker request said it was aimed at the community at
> http://www.twoplustwo.com and specifically said "this project will
> only seek to involve content that would be out of Wikipedia's scope".
> A wiki where poker players can share tips, or write about specific
> non-notable games they've played doesn't fit in with anything
> Wikimedia is likely to do, in my opinion.
>
The project is for the most part out of Wikipedia's scope (there is
some overlap but I see that as inevitable and not a bad thing).  I
think it's well within the scope of Wikimedia, though.  I think you've
slightly misidentified the actual purpose of the site, too.  Maybe the
original proposal mentioned writing about specific non-notable games,
but I haven't seen anything like that.  I mean, why would a
non-notable game be mentioned?  Some example questions from
http://poker.wikicities.com/wiki/PokerWiki:Why_a_wiki%3F

    * What games are spread at the Borgata?
    * How should I play a pair of jacks under the gun?
    * What are the basic rules of five-card stud?
    * How should I manage my bankroll?
    * What are some basics every beginner should know?

I can't "imagine a world in which every single person is given free
access to the sum of all human knowledge" without it.  (and lest
someone misunderstand my quote that's from
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Home)

Maybe this is an anomaly, but PokerWiki is an example of a project on
Wikicities that I'd like to see in Wikimedia.  <sarcastic humor>Maybe
we could start a Wikibook about poker and use that site as an
incubator.</sarcastic humor>

> > I don't understand any of this.  Is scratchpad.wikicities.com a
> > Wikimedia project?
>
> No, the WikiLab at scratchpad.wikicities.com is a Wikicity. What is
> currently called "Seed Wiki" on meta would be the Wikimedia version of
> this, though hopefully will more of a policy of what was allowed to be
> there.
>
That's what I thought, in which case I don't really see what you're
trying to say.  Maybe you thought I was saying there should be no
policy on the seed wiki?  I certainly wasn't.  <strikethrough
reason='see explanation below'>You're the one who said that it would
wind up being a fork of Wikicities, not me.</strikethrough>

> > The process to create a new project is far too difficult.  An
> > incubator wiki would facilitate that process.
>
> Yes, but it should only facilitate it for things the community
> actually want there, not everything someone thinks would make a good
> wiki. There are hundreds of wiki ideas that are rejected even from
> Wikicities. If you look a wikifarm with no policy, like pbwiki.com,
> you'll see the sort of content I'm concerned about ending up on this
> "seed wiki" if people think it is a general dumping ground rather than
> something where the project proposals need to be community approved.
>
Obviously the community should decide what goes in the seed wiki and
what doesn't.  But I think we've developed a good process for the
community to decide - a wiki.  Artificially raising the bar to require
board support for people just to begin working on something new, using
Wikimedia resources, is not good idea.

And I re-read the current policies on new project creation.  From what
I've read it seems to be completely a board decision, though the board
is supposed to consider a poll.

> > By the way, I just realized that some people might misunderstand my
> > quote.  Angela, referring to wikiseed (the incubator wiki), said in an
> > IRC board meeting "Angela thinks it will end up being a fork of
> > Wikicities."  That's all I was referring to when I referred to the
> > project that way.
>
> This was my concern *if* the site was going to be set up without any
> policies on what content should be there (which luckily isn't the case
> now that people are discussing these policies on meta). Without those
> policies, it wouldn't only be a fork of Wikicities, but of any wiki
> hosting project / wikifarm.
>
> Angela.

Sorry about that then.  It wasn't clear to me when I read this that
that was what you meant.

Clearly the seed wiki should have policies on what content should be
there.  I really don't think anyone was ever suggesting that there
shouldn't.

Anthony