[Foundation-l] Wikipedia ... but where are you going ... (was:Enforcing WP:CITE ...)

Sat Dec 3 14:29:41 UTC 2005

Really today I wanted to write about my presentation in Cracow, the 
feedback I got from "not Wikipedians" to the Wikimedia projects ... well 
and now I just read a long list of e-mails on how to make Wikipedia an 
encyclopaedia with "secure" information.

"Secure" information is a very POV thingie ... what is secure ... 
written by people I believe? Written by someone I don't know whose 
website or book is quoted? Hmmmm ... we already know that: all 
encyclopaedias include errors. All books can contain wrong information. 
Now when I presume that Mr Cancellor XYZ only because he is Mr. XYZ says 
the truth I quote him and therefore I am "regular". Then there is that 
person who read hundreds of books, websites, e-mails and whatsoever and 
just "knows" but does not really recall where all the information he/she 
has in the grey cells comes from, but knows that there are controversary 
points about a theme, knows that what Mr XYZ says is not 100% ok, but 
this is then considered as "insecure information" and therefore needs to 
be discarded ... well ... ehm ... sorry ...

Then again: since I had to explain the basics about Wikipedia during the 
conference I used two articles for reference:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nupedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia

Now what you are writing in all these mails (well those who are for 
"citing") gives very much the expression of Nupedia and not Wikipedia 
... where is freedom gone?
Then considering "Wikipedia" as it was wanted to be ... where is it 
going? Into some kind of dead-end place for only academics and researchers?

Hmmmm .........

Let's consider translators: we have our specific subjects, but also 
translate loads of general texts - this means when working we also learn 
... well: we know loads of things, not only words ... so now a colleague 
wants to write about a subject he/she knows really well ... but who of 
us is able to recall where all the information we have in mind comes 
from? I don't. So only because we are not able to remeber every single 
source we read during our researches our information is less valid ... 
hmmmm .... well .... for me this would mean: we are not going to 
contribute anything since it does not make sense - it would be deleted 
... or ... wait ... there is one thing that could be done ...

Take a dump of wikipedia, put it on a server and just go ahead editing 
... great!!!! what an idea!!! Wikipedia showed how to do this in its 
beginnings ... well what Wikipedia did can be done by anyone ... we are 
talking about GFDL ...

Fine ... wonderful .... so just go ahead restricting contributors - go 
into your dead-end position and you will see that Wikipedia will follow 
Nupedia - and that someone considered a bit mad will just take over the 
contents and allow people to edit like it was done up to now.

Well ... now you say: but newspapers criticise us ... and here I tell 
you: whoever has success is being criticised - in the end: they are 
making a huge compliment to Wikipedia - it became so huge and important 
that it needs to be criticised ...

Come on: let them talk - let's just go ahead working without listening 
to them doing our best. The day is not far and they will need to stop 
because Wikipedia will show them that liberty and democracy survives any 
attack.

Hmmm .....

Well ... think well about what you are doing to your dearest project and 
don't repeat errors done in the past.

The Cracow-Conference follow up will come ... as soon as time permits.

*****
I just read Danny's message: you understand it like this, some other 
people understand it like this, but what is going to come out is a huge 
mess since the "citing is necessary" thingie will be interpreted in a 
very wrong way ... try it out and you will see ... things like these 
arleady happen - not for citing but for other "requirements".
*****

Have a great week-end!

Sabine

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