[Wikipedia-l] Polite Thoughtful Neo-Nazis, was NSM88, deletion of user page image, personal attacks

Thu Feb 17 15:17:05 UTC 2005

Now that I've watched the discussion, I have some things to say about this. 

First of all, I *strongly* object to arguments like "nothing more 'graphic'
than a 'Nazi uniform'."...wearing a Nazi uniform is quite a strong
statement, at least for Europeans. "If I should upload an image of myself
wearing a Democratic or Republican pin, for example, would that be
"disruptive"?" -> How can one even THINK of putting a democrat or republican
on the same level as a Nazi ? 

I completely support NSK when he says that "the administrators were right to
delete it. Neo-Nazis will not be tolerated in Wikipedia." Maybe people
outside Europe don't get the point as much as we do, since we had
grandparents fighting in WWII, lost family members, and obviously have
already a different attitude towards all Nazi-symbols. Plus, on the lb wiki,
the guy would have been banned from the start since nazi-symbols are
considered to be illegal and must not be posted in Luxembourg (even if the
servers aren't in Lux, the pages are written in luxembourgish and the public
is luxembourgish).

Ok, maybe the way the administrator proceeded to make the blocks was not in
the same way that someone else would have done them, but that's the only
objection I have to make. How can we possibly tolerate a user who already by
his username does offend a great deal of other contributors and moreover has
links on his userpage to a site where I can't even find the words to
describe it.  

IMHO,

Caroline aka Briséis (lb, fr).

-----Message d'origine-----
De : wikipedia-l-bounces at Wikimedia.org
[mailto:wikipedia-l-bounces at Wikimedia.org] De la part de David Gerard
Envoyé : jeudi 17 février 2005 15:29
À : wikipedia-l at Wikimedia.org
Objet : Re: [Wikipedia-l] Polite Thoughtful Neo-Nazis, was NSM88,deletion of
user page image, personal attacks

Fred Bauder (fredbaud at ctelco.net) [050218 01:23]:

> True and in our human attempt to adequately describe such folks we use 
> the words "totalitarian" and "terrorist", in reference to such 
> organizations and governments as the People's Republic of China and 
> individuals such as Osama bin Ladin. Such folks do not hesitate to 
> "mess up other things for the cause". There is every reason, based on 
> their history, to presume that they will conduct themselves in that 
> way on Wikipedia and in fact they routinely do so, some crudely, some with
a measure of sophistication.

Astroturfing in general is going to be a problem. See:

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:204.251.90.242

The edit in question is here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Yahoo%21&diff=prev&oldid=10339741

That's a crude example. I am certain there are much less crude examples
ongoing as we speak.

- d.
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