[WikiEN-l] Introducing a new mailing list

Tue Dec 5 17:23:00 UTC 2006

On 12/5/06, niht-hræfn <nihthraefn at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 5, 2006, at 11:55, Bryan Derksen wrote:
> > What, are you saying I'm fat??
>
> Despite the fact that you're joking, and despite the fact that I'm
> not personally offended, that is a sexist remark. I find it
> especially inappropriate to make jokes at women's expense in a thread
> protesting the idea that women are treated in any way badly on this
> list.

I didn't get his joke, so I can't say that you're wrong... but I
totally don't get the exchange here. What the #$@# does being obese
have to do with being female?

> I really am shocked at the responses on this list. I'd think that the
> proper response would be, "I'm really sorry that you feel this way
> and that we never noticed it before. Is there any way we can make
> help make Wikipedia a more welcoming place for women?" and if the
> women said, "You know, it'd really help to have an all-women mailing
> list where we can talk about things without being ignored or
> dismissed," I'd hope you'd say, "It's a shame it's come to this, but
> if that will help, let's give it a try."

You're making it out like the opposition to the sexist list was a
woman vs men thing. It's not. Yes, you have more men opposing.. but we
have more men in total.

Lets put it another way: We've had women get harassed from their
involvement on the wiki and their presence has attracted a number of
trolls who specifically get their jollies from harassing women.   If
someone suggested that we should exclude women from editing the wiki,
should we "try it"?

> What I really never expected was that the community as it were would
> belittle the concerns brought forward by the women and go so far as
> to make fun of them.

You. Do. Not. Speak. For. All. Women.

If you honestly wish to fight sexism then you need to stop
perpetuating it yourself.