Hi all,
I agree with Teemu. Definition of both missions give us the
difference:
I think Wikibooks mission
is very clear: "to create a free collection of open-content
textbooks".
The mission of the Wikiversity should then be: to create and run
free
learning projects.
I also think that Wikiversity needs the opportunity to host peaces of
Wikibook�s texts and Wikipedia�s articles and modify them. But just
peaces. Full texts should be placed on those pages.
I agree in part with this. It is false to think that there is a clear
distinction between learning projects and textbooks, at least if if you
think of learning projects as learning communities. Textbooks are not
the only learning resource. Learning projects should include learning
materials which are preferably interactive. I think creating interactive
materials is a job for wikiversity, not wikibooks, and it is a job we
are not doing.
So I agree that wikibooks is for complete textbooks. Wikiversity should
host communities of learners, along with course structures, course
materials, interactive materials and bits from wikibooks and wikipedia.
I think the idea of wikiversity in many languages is not likely to work.
The English language wikiversity is struggling.
Brian. [[Bduke]]
And something from international point of view. I am Czech, my native
language is Czech. Actully Czech wikipedia is on the 22nd possition
with its more than 80 000 articles. We are also having in our language
other projects excepting Wikiversity and Wikinews. Other projects
allready exists for a few years, but they are still in the phoetal
phase. Number of speaker of Czech language is decreasing. It means, we
are practicaly running just Wikipedia.
I dont prefer English for communication, thats why I found a few month
ago Czech Wikiversity on beta, but now I see, that I we would not be
abble to go for new language version request on meta. There are just
about 3-5 interested people in extendeing its content. There is noone
interested in maintaining that system. We are having no resource on
Wikibooks. So I would say, we are wasting a lot of energy and time
there. And this would be simillar on other wikiversities.
So for this time, it seems me familiar to centralize all of these
people under one website and for the deep future, there might be a
possibility to differ these languages for different domains.
And one more thing on the and. Ive been on WM Polska conference this
year, having a presentation about Wikiversity. Most interest was there
from the site of Wikibookians, but their opinion was pesimistic. I
think wikibookians are a little bit affraid of loosing something. It
is important to explaing that Wikiversity is completly different
projects and not just Wikibookians will make Wikiversity�s community.
See en.wikiversity, there are also people from Wikipedia (like me) and
for the future I think, new people from outside will joint - with
methodological skills.
Juan de Vojn�kov (aka Juan)
2007/11/13, Teemu Leinonen <[1]teemu.leinonen(a)taik.fi>fi>:
Hi Cormac,
thank you for raising up this important topic in the list. I hope
this does not end-up to be a re-run of argumentation you and me
already have had.
Cormac Lawler kirjoitti 13.11.2007 kello 23:20:
this has had the
practical outcome that these communities have extended the scope
of
the Wikibooks project from what other Wikibooks
projects are
doing -
in hosting lesson plans and pedagogic guidance
for using these
textbooks in class. (This latter seems to be more suited to
Wikiversity in my mind at least - is this also the same for you,
and/or is it a problem?)
I think the whole Wikiversity should give-up the
"content
production"
and focus on hosting communities of learners who want to do things
together. This way Wikiversity should have only good descriptions
of
"learning projects", which are communities interested in to help
each
other to learn something. David Wiley's syllabus of Introduction to
Open Education class is a great example of this kind of use of a
wiki, here:
[
2]http://www.opencontent.org/wiki/index.php?
title=How_to_use_a_wiki_to_facilitate_learning
This way the Wikiversity pages should focus on to manage the
"learning projects", whereas the "learning content" would be
there
where they naturally belong to: in the other Wikimedia project's
sites, such as Wikibooks, Wikicommons, Wikipedia etc. These
projects
are already there to have "educational content" in them. In the
Wikiversity learning project pages there would be then of course
links to the content pages (Wikibooks etc.).
Put another way: what does Wikiversity do (or
intend to
do) that Wikibooks can never do, as presently defined?
Making a meaningful
structure for "learning projects" and offering
them for people so that it is very easy to participate in them is
something Wikibooks probably will never do. I think Wikibooks
mission
is very clear: "to create a free collection of open-content
textbooks".
The mission of the Wikiversity should then be: to create and run
free
learning projects.
So, the 'international' dimension here
comes down to whether it
is
possible - or useful - to define how Wikiversity
and Wikibooks
would
relate _in_all_languages. If it is possible
and/or useful, then
it
might be timely to actively construct such a map
of how the two
projects relate (eg how much overlap is ok, what the scope of
each is,
and how they can share resources etc), and set
out a framework
for how
different languages can be set up, defined and
organised around
various activities.
I think the Wikiversity should be one, but multi-lingual.
In
Wikiversity we should offer "learning projects" in many languages
and
not build many parallel Wikiversitys in different languages. The
languages could simple be defined with categories. This would
promote
people to do some studies on Wikiversity also in some foreign
language, which is very "educational". :-)
- Teemu
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[3]Wikiversity-l(a)lists.wikimedia.org
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4]http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikiversity-l
References
1. mailto:teemu.leinonen@taik.fi
2.
http://www.opencontent.org/wiki/index.php
3. mailto:Wikiversity-l@lists.wikimedia.org
4.
http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikiversity-l
--
Brian Salter-Duke b_duke(a)bigpond.net.au
[[User:Bduke]] mainly on en:Wikipedia.
Also on fr: Wikipedia, Meta-Wiki and Wikiversity