On 10/09/2007, Roberto Bahamonde Andrade <chilotin(a)gmail.com> wrote: I'm sorry about that. I cut and changed bits of translations done by several people over the years, and I expected for there to be non-agreement of verbs in this way. As for what should be used, I guess whatever you would use on the Main Page of your language's Wikipedia would be the one to go with. So long as it all agrees :) In another matter, I asked people to translate "Wikimedia Foundation" for the page heading and also within the text (e.g. "Wikimédia" in French). But Britty has informed me that, when we're working with Latin-scripted languages, we are highly encouraged to use the English form "Wikimedia Foundation" and not translate it at all. Should I ask people to go through the translations and change them to read "Wikimedia Foundation", change it myself (which is troublesome because some languages surround English text with special quote characters) or leave it? ~Mark Ryan

The Chinese translation does not include any mention of IRC. Is there a #wikipedia-zh channel? 2007/9/10, Rodolfo M Vega <rmvega(a)cs.cmu.edu>du>:

P.S. Tor is banned on Freenode. 2007/9/11, Casey Brown <cbrown1023.ml(a)gmail.com>om>:

On 9/10/07, Mark Ryan <ultrablue(a)gmail.com> wrote: I think Skype is used instead. http://tinyurl.com/3xwnxk has a section near the end with information on various skype channels used for Wikipedia chat. Angela

Chinese wiki contributors use Skype and Google Group for discussions. They do not use any IRC network because IRC is not popular amount Chinese people. If you mean Mainland Chinese people, they could edit Wikipedia via TOR and discuss on Skype. Ted (Hsiang-Tai)

Ted, no, they can't edit Wikipedia through TOR. Wikipedia does not allow editing through TOR and other open proxies. That's why Baidu Baike is flourishing. 2007/9/11, Mark Ryan <ultrablue(a)gmail.com>om>:

I see. "No open proxies" (http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/No_open_proxies) is a "Meta"-policy, which means that it applies to all Wikipedias and Wikimedia projects. Fortunately, the admins on the Chinese Wikipedia do not enforce this Meta-policy. This Meta-policy discriminates against the Chinese (and those in countries where Wikipedia is censored/blocked by the government) and should be abolished. 2007/9/11, Ted (Hsiang-Tai) Chien <hsiangtai.chien(a)gmail.com>om>:

"They are allowed to use Tor"? How can they, if Wikipedia hard-blocks Tor proxies? 2007/9/11, Vee <vee.be.me(a)gmail.com>om>:

On 12/09/2007, Mark Ryan <ultrablue(a)gmail.com> wrote: Yah that's pretty much how it is. You can use them if/when you find unblocked proxies (there are quite a few afaik) and no one will hold it against you... but yeah it's not exactly an open-arms welcome

2007/9/11, Kat Walsh <kat(a)mindspillage.org>rg>: Well, I have heard differently. Here some comments made during discussions about the blocking of open proxies on Dutch Wikipedia: "I hate to bitch but: het blokkeren van open proxies is foundation policy. Mi dus niet iets waar "wij" (lees de lokale community) iets over te zeggen hebben." transl.: "I had to bitch but: blocking open proxies is foundation policy. In my opinion therefore not something where "we" (read: the local community) have a say in." "het blokkeren van OP's is formeel beleid op alle Wikimediaprojecten" transl.: "Blocking open proxies is formal policy on all Wikimedia projects" -- Andre Engels, andreengels(a)gmail.com ICQ: 6260644 -- Skype: a_engels

On 9/12/07, Andre Engels <andreengels(a)gmail.com> wrote: They're wrong. :-) It may be a popular policy, but it's up to individual projects. (And I think that where it is implemented, it's very much a sad compromise to keep back the flow of crap and abuse that comes along with the legitimate uses, rather than something all projects should do on principle.) -Kat -- Wikimedia needs you: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Fundraising * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Mindspillage | (G)AIM:Mindspillage mindspillage or mind|wandering on irc.freenode.net | email for phone

J.L.W.S. The Special One wrote: Baidu Baike is flourishing because you don't need Tor to edit it. And because it shows up in Baidu, the most popular search engine in China. There are no IP addresses currently blocked on the Chinese Wikipedia with "Tor" in the reason field (as opposed to 887 on the English Wikipedia). A spot check of 6 Tor exit nodes showed that none of them were blocked on zh. Open proxies may be blocked occasionally on the Chinese Wikipedia due to vandalism, but they certainly don't have a policy of blanket blocks. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to work out why a heavily-promoted, searchable, locally-run site with equivalent content is more popular than a foreign one that requires secret and probably illegal methods to access it. -- Tim Starling

On 11/09/2007, Platonides <Platonides(a)gmail.com> wrote: Maybe, maybe not :) Quite often this error message is transitory and the site is accessible again by the time you hit 'refresh'. Ideally, the foundation server would be isolated from the others, but that's more a matter for the developers. Someone once tried putting a donation form in the error message file itself; it's not there now so I can only assume it wasn't judged to be a good idea. I only put that link to the "Reload" article there for the purposes of illustrating what would happen when you actually hit that link :) Which would be to link to the current URL, or, if Javascript is available (which is most cases), perform a page refresh (thus, hopefully, forcing browsers to give anyone who got the error message on saving a page the option to re-submit the information). As I said above, it's not in the currently live version of the error message, so I don't know why it was removed. If we were to include it, of course, it could be translated. But I think that would add so much text to the error message beyond what has already added to it by putting in an extra 12 or so languages as I have done. With the current text, the message is 45KB. ~Mark Ryan